Advice for moving into Offshore/EMS

[Police Chief Wiggum]

Greetings Slappers,

Could any of you lend some advice to someone who would like to move into the offshore/ems side of things.

Has anyone here gone down the route of an Instrument Rating in the US?? (Pros and cons of this route)

I would genuinely appreciate any insight you guys are able to offer. (Completing Instrument Rating in Australia/Co pilot options/etc)

I have 2500hrs, 350 multi engine, ATPL, IREX exams.

Cheers

[havick]

Greetings Slappers,

Could any of you lend some advice to someone who would like to move into the offshore/ems side of things.

Has anyone here gone down the route of an Instrument Rating in the US?? (Pros and cons of this route)

I would genuinely appreciate any insight you guys are able to offer. (Completing Instrument Rating in Australia/Co pilot options/etc)

I have 2500hrs, 350 multi engine, ATPL, IREX exams.

Cheers

I wouldn't waste your money doing an instrument rating in the US if you plan to fly in Australia.

I would do an Aussie IPC-me fixed wing to set yourself apart if you have a fixed wing license to attach it to.

[JohnHopkins]

Get a job at beckers like everyone else.

[muppet]

Hi Chief

Looks like you have enough time under your belt, and your multi time should help. ATPL a good start (but I am still baffled by how folk can get an ATPL without an instrument rating? How does that work?? Or have you just got the exams?)

Anyways, you are probably best to go and talk to the Chief Pilot of an EMS or offshore organization, because ultimately it is him or her that you have to impress enough to get hired. I am not involved in offshore, but with your time, a co-pilot start should be easy enough, as long as they are hiring. Cycles go up and down.

For EMS, anyone running a co-pilot operation (as opposed to pilot-assist) would look at you I imagine.

If it were me hiring, like Havick, I would prefer a fixed wing instrument rating (if you have fw licence) because that is an easy conversion. I have done conversions for people with FW IFR and those without, and it makes a huge difference in the resource required to get them over the line. Of course, this ain't so helpful if you don't have a PPL A. Sorry. I don't know much about US IFR, but have heard it is blue sky ops in a Hughes 300 which to me is not that attractive. You could gain those same skills in a decent simulator.

Good luck, you will find a way if you persevere.

[skypig]

Greetings Slappers,

Could any of you lend some advice to someone who would like to move into the offshore/ems side of things.

Has anyone here gone down the route of an Instrument Rating in the US?? (Pros and cons of this route)

I would genuinely appreciate any insight you guys are able to offer. (Completing Instrument Rating in Australia/Co pilot options/etc)

I have 2500hrs, 350 multi engine, ATPL, IREX exams.

Cheers

Look at the adverts for EMS drivers.
Work out how to get the "minimums", and as many of the "desirables" as possible.
It's very unlikely that you will get an Australian EMS position without a ME CIR, with 3 renewals, as this is often a contract requirement.
(I've applied for an EMS position, with all the minimums, and all but ME C&T of the Desirables, including endorsed and experienced on type, and years of EMS experience, and not got an interview. It's a tough market right now.)

The Off-shore co-pilot requirements are much more achievable/flexible, but in the current market there is some stiff competition for adverised positions.

Good luck. Keep moving forward.

[Yakking]

Traditionally start in offshore move towards EMS (simply due to shear numbers of drivers Offshore). Also in the past the Offshore operators have given the Co-Jo's their IF tickets although I'm guessing this is now changing due to no more Cojo IF ratings and the fact that the Offshore scene isn't what it was 5yrs ago and there are unemployed Offshore drivers looking for work.

Maybe try get into a smaller operator like HeliWest or equivalent and get on their EMS OP's in the BK or 105 (not sure if they still have the 105EMS), but at least it's getting your foot in the door.

I did my IR in America (in conjunction with my PPL,CPL, Instructor rating etc..) over ten years ago. From a cost point, it can't be beat. When I was there, it was all in 300's, 22's and 44's, no autopilots. Having the FAA IR got me my first IF job here in Australia (where they gave me the CoJo IR rating, which was basically a formality after having the FAA IR).


It's a tough market right now trying to move into the ME IFR world. With the Offshore industry contracting and the doing away with Co-pilot instrument ratings. In my opinion, no one in the industry is really sure how to make the leap across right now.

Are Europe and America a crystal ball? Will pilots in Australia being paying for their own Instrument Ratings in the future? Time will tell..... Good luck.

[stick_monkey]

I hate to say it, and I hoped that it wouldn't happen in Aus industry, but I'd say that we are now close to the European industry where you need to pay for your IR, or at least for some IF hours.
The reason I say this is because when I spoke to a senior T&C in a large Aus offshore company just after Part 61 was implemented, he said he wouldn't hire anyone without some form of an IR now as it was just too expensive for the company to train them.
I asked if a Helicopter SE IR or an Aeroplane IR would be advantage and he said yes, given that the company would need to spend less time and money on training (they only need to get you to ME IR standard then).
Anyway, the company that hires you will need to give you a TR which will include some IF training, so they will issue you a ME IR around the same time as the TR

[havick]

Stickmonkey, unfortunate it's CASA that has really caused this training burden on an individual by way of removing co-pilot instrument ratings. Now any new pilot to the IFR world is required to pass an IPC-ME and PIC type rating (if a type rating is required).

As a result operators are hiring guys that demonstrate a low training risk.

[Lude]

https://www.lifeflight.org.au/page/care ... Co-Pilots/

New ad for a Lifeflight co-pilot. There is the proof of what has been said above.

[muppet]

Looks like a good opportunity, but still somewhat tricky for those trying to get a foot in the door.
They expect the (min) 500 hour candidate to have a 412 rating (not a commonly flown helicopter for low hour pilots!), and a command Instrument Rating. Anyone who has those two requirements is most likely already employed - how else would you get them in Australia? And then work a 7/7 roster in Roma...

Oh, and if you have some NVG experience, that would be good too...

Not intending to critique the Operator here (pitch high and then see who shows up I guess and a great step up for whoever gets it), but the industry really does not encourage those coming up through the ranks does it? Compared to our slab wing brethren, we do not have a clear path for young padewan slappers. I find this quite sad, because there are probably plenty of good young folk out there, who aren't interested in a career of skid biting and time wasting, just to get that one chance in a million. This just opens the door for exploitation, which is often the case for young guys trying to get up their hours and find a break. Pressure to fly virtually for free, pressure to break F&D, push weather etc etc Instrument flying is becoming an expected norm for a large part of the industry, and will only increase as newer machines are all IFR capable. So will we make it easier for young pilots to transition, or will we still place barriers in their path?

And whoever (Yakking?) slammed the removal of a co-pilot IR was spot on...

Let me know if I have this wrong, I am certainly becoming old and cynical before my time.

[bl@ckers]

Good reply muppet!

Sums the industry up perfectly. I am one of those who always had the ambition for offshore/SAR/EMS. However, When I finally reached the minimums to enter these roles, part 61 kicks in and makes it to prohibitive for operators to employ us VFR pilots with ATPL and IREX completed. Sad really! I am looking at options to complete an MECIR in the hope it will give me an opportunity, but it is a huge gamble!

[skypig]

The industry is simply supply and demand.

Plenty of VFR pilots will be employed and "given" ME CIR when there are more jobs than qualified ME IFR pilots.
Conversely, it's very unlikely even a "freshly minted" ME CIR holder will get a start if guys with years of experience and multiple renewals apply.

It's not good, but it's the way it is.

[FerrariFlyer]

With the demand in the fixed-wind world at present I don't think it will be too long before airlines start tapping the market for rotary pilots with multi crew and multi engine experience and heavily subsidise their conversion to fixed-wing. It's already happening in the USA with ex-military rotary driver's transitioning into regionals. It was also done in the 90's in the North Sea so no reason it can't or won't happen again in the near future.

[havick]

With the demand in the fixed-wind world at present I don't think it will be too long before airlines start tapping the market for rotary pilots with multi crew and multi engine experience and heavily subsidise their conversion to fixed-wing. It's already happening in the USA with ex-military rotary driver's transitioning into regionals. It was also done in the 90's in the North Sea so no reason it can't or won't happen again in the near future.

Here in the US the rotary transition programs that the airlines are offering has recently been opened up to civilian helo pilots.

[Combustion Chamber]

So if I do the ATPL exams they can still be frozen until such time as required??

Offshore or EMS was/has always been my goal, the ladder to climb seems to be getting longer though, so fingers crossed.

[Jabberwocky]

If one was to not have a PPL-A, what would your thoughts be on gaining an instrument rating in the US? I have heard, and yet to do any research myself, that it’s not much more money to do that in The USA than it is to gain a NVFR here in Australia.