Australian Helicopter Industry Association

General stuff that gets thrown about when Helicopter Pilots shoot the Breeze.
User avatar
AHIA
2nd Dan
2nd Dan
Posts: 470
Joined: Feb 2012

Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby AHIA » Sun Feb 12 2012, 10:46

Just some good news about a steering committee that is being formed to re-launch an industry association to help the helicopter people promote their capabilities, seek a better deal with CASA and assist in keeping the loss rate within limits.

We are seeking expressions of interest from those who would like to help; and also the topics and concerns that need to be listed and given a priority.

Within a few weeks free data bases will be available in pdf form to anyone who needs updates, etc.

Thanks to Bladeslapper for giving us a chance to establish a national body to foster the industry.

Just a point of clarification. We are not a trade union. If you need one, then the AFAP is the custodian of the pilots' awards, etc.

However, we will review and make submissions and given opinions on pay issues if asked.

More soon .........

Acting President
User avatar
havick
3rd Dan
3rd Dan
Posts: 990
Joined: Jun 2007

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby havick » Sun Feb 12 2012, 11:14

Who's involved so far?
"You'll have to speak up, I'm wearing a towel."
Min Min
Silver Wings
Silver Wings
Posts: 22
Joined: Feb 2011

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Min Min » Sun Feb 12 2012, 19:49

i'm a bit interested in something like this, but a specific arm, could you please pm me, contacts and so on
cheers
skidmark
Silver Wings
Silver Wings
Posts: 31
Joined: Oct 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby skidmark » Sun Feb 12 2012, 21:18

Shouldn't the Acting President of a proposed representative body identify his/herself?

Sorry for the pessimism, but any amateur hour secret squirrel mission to get an association up run by a few close heli mates is stuffed already. Be professional if you want to have professionals interested.
User avatar
hand in pants
4th Dan
4th Dan
Posts: 1375
Joined: Sep 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby hand in pants » Sun Feb 12 2012, 22:00

AHIA, I agree with Skiddie. name some name and give us some more details.
If we don't get information on the public forum, we will tend NOT to be interested.
You must be semi up and running if you have an "acting president"

So lets hear the details please.....................
Hand in Pants, I'm thinking, my god, that IS huge!!!!!!!!
User avatar
CYHeli
4th Dan
4th Dan
Posts: 1805
Joined: Jun 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby CYHeli » Sun Feb 12 2012, 22:07

AHIA. Not off to great start. Not the press release that most on here would've written. And that's what a public announcement is, a press release. Acting President is also not the best tittle initially, especially anonymously!

Good luck and for the right reasons, I would get behind such an organisation, I did for the HAA.
What you leave behind is not what is engraved in stone monuments, but what is woven into the lives of others.
BenThomas
1st Dan
1st Dan
Posts: 207
Joined: Sep 2009

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby BenThomas » Mon Feb 13 2012, 01:03

When you google Australian Helicopter Industry Association the only hits you get are for this topic on Bladeslappers. I would be very careful guys and gals, looks like a fishing expedition to me.
User avatar
Nawty
2nd Dan
2nd Dan
Posts: 484
Joined: Feb 2010

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Nawty » Mon Feb 13 2012, 02:03

I prefer the AAIA group
User avatar
helothere
Sensei
Sensei
Posts: 1086
Joined: Sep 2005

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby helothere » Mon Feb 13 2012, 02:22

It's actually someone of repute who was involved with the HAA in the earlier days. I don't know the reason for the anonymity but the formation of this organisation is genuine and has the industry as a whole in it's best interests. I don't see this as an announcement of formation, more putting out feelers to see who may be interested in getting involved in what seems a re-build of the former HAA.

Give it a chance people, it can only be a good thing I reckon.
Heli-Ops
3rd Dan
3rd Dan
Posts: 554
Joined: Sep 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Heli-Ops » Mon Feb 13 2012, 02:43

I would be happy to give you some space in each issue of HeliOps to promote the new association if the people behind it are reputable.
User avatar
havick
3rd Dan
3rd Dan
Posts: 990
Joined: Jun 2007

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby havick » Mon Feb 13 2012, 03:39

re-build of the former HAA


Not necessarily a good thing at all. I think realistically if it were to have any legs/credibility then there would have to be no ties to the HAA or its' former self.

Call my a cynic, but I honestly think unless it's run by a clean slate of people with no alterior motives (or potential for conflict of interest) then it's going to end up the same way as HAA did.
"You'll have to speak up, I'm wearing a towel."
Twin Head
Silver Wings
Silver Wings
Posts: 92
Joined: Sep 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Twin Head » Mon Feb 13 2012, 03:55

Unfortunately anyone who steps up to this plate and currently runs a charter business will always be under scrutiny for the benefits of being in charge, yes like the old presidents from HAA.

I wish all the best for the new scheme as I was involved with HAA in the late 80's to the late 90's. They accomplished some very good procedures that still remain with us pilots today.
User avatar
papillons
1st Dan
1st Dan
Posts: 287
Joined: Jan 2011

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby papillons » Mon Feb 13 2012, 04:01

I'm interested in helping if the old HAA connection(s) aren't/weren't too entwined with the personalities and I'll feeling towards the end, when the grumbles re: nepotism and funds bleed started appearing. There were some good leaders in the old Sydney push. I'm from Sydney and wherever this new concern happens to be centered I'd be happy to help waggle its flag down here (as much as my 1/2 cent of industry cred could help...)

Take your point about the union stuff but any industry body worth a spit is going to have to be highly inclusive of the next generation of CP/AOC holders anyway. The things I personally am most interested in are:

- making cohesive public noise about helicopters: what they can do in emergencies, what the public and policy-makers need to do to help us thrive, so we're there en masse when needed;
- which means all sorts of tax, investment and operating subsidy changes, etc
- reduced beauracracy/increased freedom of ops
- solution to the insurance killer
- feasible career projection/paths
- accurate up-to-date data base of acft, pilots, endorsements, ratings, industry activity cycles etc...so the training sector (and its customers!) can be a bit smarter and more strategic about producing new pilots;
- helipads for cities
- faster and more transparent accident reporting
- more honest internal self-scrutiny of standards, especially re: accidents

Good luck...like others here, I'm retaining the right to remain a bit cautious until a bit more info comes to light!
¡Librame!
its allgood
Silver Wings
Silver Wings
Posts: 42
Joined: Aug 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby its allgood » Mon Feb 13 2012, 09:42

May I also suggest that if you are serious about a representative body, that you seek representatives from as many helicopter companies as possible via phone/email/post rather than just here. I know my employers are keen to have a say but never look on this site and would probably not take you seriously if this is the only advertising of the revamped haa or equivalent, you intend to do.
My two cents worth
User avatar
hand in pants
4th Dan
4th Dan
Posts: 1375
Joined: Sep 2006

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby hand in pants » Mon Feb 13 2012, 10:57

I will happily help if I can. How much help I would be I've no idea.

Let me know what is required and we can see if I'm any use. For that matter, if you put out what you are after, you may be surprised (pleasantly) at the number of people interested...............
Hand in Pants, I'm thinking, my god, that IS huge!!!!!!!!
User avatar
Tactical71
1st Dan
1st Dan
Posts: 217
Joined: Mar 2011

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Tactical71 » Tue Feb 14 2012, 10:21

Acting President..........

His name is not Stuart, is it????
Robinsondog
2nd Dan
2nd Dan
Posts: 471
Joined: Feb 2003

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby Robinsondog » Wed Feb 15 2012, 12:35

AAIA


I'll bite, is that Aussie Alcos In Asia?

seriously any feed back or much interet as yet?

where etc?
CaptSpry
Silver Wings
Silver Wings
Posts: 82
Joined: Sep 2009

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby CaptSpry » Wed Feb 15 2012, 23:43

Interesting thread. What is AAIA? Is it a self regulating association? Maybe their model may be worthy of consideration. Just a thought. Nawty can you help?
User avatar
AHIA
2nd Dan
2nd Dan
Posts: 470
Joined: Feb 2012

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby AHIA » Thu Feb 16 2012, 00:58

Thanks for the feedback. I am going to answer all your comments soon to ensure all questions you have raised are answered for the benefit of all.

I am really not the Acting President, so you can relax. (Apologies). Our draft constitution has not been finished; we need to see what you guys want and your greatest needs. Then we can plan an organisation to fit; but in the meantime we have to see how it can be achieved.

So I am but a low key coordinator of like minded people from within and without the industry who have suggested someone needs to do something to see if we can have representation to focus on some of the many challengers heading our way. But someone has to collect ideas and seek advice so AHIA can develop.

Other chores are planning for the day when we will have an AGM and do all that not-for profit paperwork to allow the members to work hassle free within a professional and effective industry association.

So please keep giving us your thoughts - positive and negative. Be a bit kind on the latter, (we are volunteers). We do not want this project to suffer "death by bladeslapper" too early, as many threads here seem to eventually end up under a negative cloud and lose energy.

More later ........ great to see your ideas coming ........

PS: Why am I supporting our Australian industry? Look at the recent news from banks, manufacturing companies, car makers and even QANTAS today. We must be globally aware - we do not even own Vegemite anymore!
User avatar
papillons
1st Dan
1st Dan
Posts: 287
Joined: Jan 2011

Re: Australian Helicopter Industry Association

Postby papillons » Thu Feb 16 2012, 01:28

AHIA, if you're looking for 'big picture' strategies within which to frame the new organisation's ethos/raison détre/lobbying framework....here's Virginia Chadwick (RIP), NSW Libs, trying to head off the private members bill introduced at the last minute by Sandra Nori (anti-Sydney-helipad NIMBY-in-Chief back in the mid 90's) to blindside the (theoretically-approved) site at Darling Harbour:

http://www.parliament.nsw.gov.au/Prod/parlment/hanstrans.nsf/V3ByKey/LC19940308?open&refNavID=HA2_1

Another point to be carefully considered is the need for a strong helicopter industry. No one disputes the emergency value of helicopters. After experiencing the trauma of the recent bushfires in New South Wales I defy anyone to say helicopters are not of great value to our community. We need a strong helicopter industry. These facilities have to be put in place. It appears that everyone loves a helicopter and during the bushfires everyone was grateful for them as long as they did not land anywhere near a backyard unless, of course, there was a fire or an emergency and then they were needed in a hurry. Currently there are no secure open area landing sites close to the CBD that have fuel and are available in an emergency. Everyone who lives or works in the CBD should seriously consider that matter. Normal, light commercial helicopters and pilots are our most important reserve when faced with an emergency. The January bushfires are the most recent display of the invaluable role helicopters play in meeting a State emergency.

The Hon. Franca Arena: No one is disputing that; we just do not want them in residential areas.


See, to me, there-in lies THE lay down misere approach for any halfway decent HAA to prosecute, especially in the wake of floods, fires, etc. That's the 'sell': help us build a strong h/c industry, so that we're there when you need us. This was a big underlying part of the way the HAA/Sydney Media Club got so close (even just on this one small, parochial ádvance). Incidentally, it's worth us younger guys educating ourselves on what that generation did come close to achieving. Not to blow smoke up their arse; but to get an idea of what it means to lobby for an industry. The sheer issue grunt work you can see for yourself, if you want to kill a couple of hours trolling through old Hansard debates: the studies commissioned, the individuals lobbied, the paperwork churned out...meetings, debates, media slots. No-one should be under any illusion about how hard and time-consuming it is to represent your industry well. Just that one localised helipad project took decades, really, and a shedload of unpaid leeeeerve.

So I think that people shoud be a little relaxed about the whole 'self-interest' thing, as such. Fact: changing the industry takes enormous energy, time, slog. So you're going to need some source of motivation with legs, as any given Association individual mover and shaker. My own caution doesn't really lie in the 'self-interest' angle as such: I wouldn't have any problem at all being a member of a national association based, say, up on the Gold Coast, and run by, say, industry leaders up there whose key immediate focus was on things that affected their operations (training sector, say). In fact, the way I see it - having just watched my bro go through the endless blood-from-a-stone bureaucratic épic that is...securing an AOC - is that about the ONLY industry figures with the drive, self-belief, work-rate, grit, ego and savvy that would be needed to run any meaningful industry association, will be those who got their own company up and running first. Same kind of person needed for either start-from-scratch journey, IMHO. One of the less admirable things about (many) pilots is that (many of us) tend to sit back on our arse when it comes to starting new things; many of us prefer to let a few blokes take the risks, try to create something out of nothing, while we mumble behind our hands that it's all gunna fail dismally...then, only when it's up and running, do (most of us) stick up our hands up enthusiastically, clap and hooray, shout: 'Well done mate...(now, gimme a job - oh, and how much you gunna pay me, btw...!??)

To me, when óne h/c company does well, there will nearly always be trickle-down benefits of some kind or other. So whoever you are, AHIA, good luck to you. Except for the Funds Disclaimer...as I said, or alluded to, above, with reference to the demise of the last incarnation of HAA: what I WOULD (more generally) be very hesitant about is paying subs to any group that had any but purely administrative staff on a payroll. I am a bit hazy on what happened after the Nori blocker bill above passed and stymied that a-l-m-o-s-t Sydney pad...except that I know there was a big wodge of NSW compo paid to the HAA (?) afterwards (because the EPA had already approved the tender/bid when Nori's bill rendered the approval useless).

So the NSW taxpayer had to foot the compo bill. (Yay, good one, u NIMBY clots.)

Anyway: point being that it was, as far as I can tell (these days everyone in the know talks in hushed whispers only about it!), the subsequent melting away of this wodge of dough which has now caused a bit of stink to waft down the last few years of HAA revival talk. I am too johnny-come-lately, helopolitically-ignorant and ambivalent to be sure of deciding where exactly the truth lies, but - as a general rule - my own STRONG preference for any trade/professional association I join is: elected/answerable office bearers must be voluntary positions. Expenses, sure. Maybe a single Board member (auditor, no connection to helo industry) could get a small retainer. Phone answerer, data puncher, low-level admin/office management job...sure, pay something enough to ensure they're slick and on-the-ball with all member concerns/queries (nothing dries up subs quicker than an Answering Machine that never does and a Monthly Newsletter that never is). But the rest - Pres/Sec/Project Officers/lobbyists....sorry, but you do it as a labor of love...with the quid pro quo being, necessarily, that your membership have to accept that you guys doing the lobbying grunt work will have a natural bias towards/expertise in industry-wide improvements grounded in their own external commercial interests. How could it be any other way?

But if such connections are transparent, then I begrudge no-one who gets out and does the grinding time. Authentic transparency ensures that if you get to the point that a majority reckons the skew IS becoming too outrageously self-interested, with not enough general trickle-down gain as a by-product....then OK, you vote them out. Volunteerism also means, btw, that those who take on those elected slots protect themselves against accusations of financial shabbiness/jobs-for-mates, etc (justified or not).

Sorry for the length, BS. Just a few thoughts, is all. One thing that might be refreshing would be if a few older guys - who know - spoke candidly about what happened with/to the HAA over the last decade or so. But really - every time you watch the telly, you see this or that Sector flogging themselves relentlessly to the Grate Orstrayun Public (right now in NSW it's 'Public Education' and the bloody Opera House)...and it drives me bonkers that we helicopter drivers - the coolest human beings on the planet, ever - just ain't getting a good enough collective press. Time we got our PR poo in one sock.
¡Librame!

Return to “On the Job”

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 2 guests